Dialogue

  1 Craty|           agree with Cratylus or with Hermogenes, and is he serious in those
  2 Craty|    personifying, in the characters of Hermogenes, Socrates, and Cratylus,
  3 Craty|              persons of the dialogue, Hermogenes and Cratylus, are at the
  4 Craty|       interposes between them. First, Hermogenes, the poor brother of the
  5 Craty|             first of all intimates to Hermogenes that his view of language
  6 Craty|          between truth and falsehood. Hermogenes is very ready to throw aside
  7 Craty|           views are not like those of Hermogenes, hastily taken up, but are
  8 Craty|            respectively propounded by Hermogenes, Socrates, Cratylus, may
  9 Craty|             answer to the question of Hermogenes, which is evidently the
 10 Craty|               explanation of the name Hermogenes, either as ‘not being in
 11 Craty|       etymologists. The simplicity of Hermogenes, who is ready to believe
 12 Craty|         Heracleitean philosopher, and Hermogenes, the brother of Callias,
 13 Craty|            not allow that the name of Hermogenes is equally true. Hermogenes
 14 Craty|           Hermogenes is equally true. Hermogenes asks Socrates to explain
 15 Craty|             When Cratylus denies that Hermogenes is a true name, he supposes
 16 Craty|               and to hear both sides.~Hermogenes is of opinion that there
 17 Craty|               be true or false. Would Hermogenes maintain that anybody may
 18 Craty|              the time of giving them? Hermogenes replies that this is the
 19 Craty|     Protagoras, that what appears is? Hermogenes has always been puzzled
 20 Craty|         letters is not the easy task, Hermogenes, which you imagine.~‘I should
 21 Craty|       difficult question.’ O, my dear Hermogenes, I believe that there was
 22 Craty|            goggulon. That is my view, Hermogenes, of the correctness of names;
 23 Craty|           some account of his theory. Hermogenes and himself are mere sciolists,
 24 Craty|               asked about the name of Hermogenes, who is acknowledged to
 25 Craty|              Hail, Athenian Stranger, Hermogenes! would these words be true
 26 Craty|               must remind you of what Hermogenes and I were saying about
 27 Craty|               compelled to admit with Hermogenes in Plato and with Horace
 28 Craty|               THE DIALOGUE: Socrates, Hermogenes, Cratylus.~HERMOGENES: Suppose
 29 Craty|       Socrates, Hermogenes, Cratylus.~HERMOGENES: Suppose that we make Socrates
 30 Craty|              CRATYLUS: If you please.~HERMOGENES: I should explain to you,
 31 Craty|            the world were to call you Hermogenes, that would not be your
 32 Craty|               your name is not really Hermogenes, I suspect that he is only
 33 Craty|             we have heard both sides.~HERMOGENES: I have often talked over
 34 Craty|            say that you may be right, Hermogenes: let us see;—Your meaning
 35 Craty|            anybody agrees to call it?~HERMOGENES: That is my notion.~SOCRATES:
 36 Craty|              an individual or a city?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Well, now,
 37 Craty|          world:—that is your meaning?~HERMOGENES: He would, according to
 38 Craty|             words a true and a false?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
 39 Craty|               and false propositions?~HERMOGENES: To be sure.~SOCRATES: And
 40 Craty|               says that which is not?~HERMOGENES: Yes; what other answer
 41 Craty|            there is a true and false?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: But
 42 Craty|             and are the parts untrue?~HERMOGENES: No; the parts are true
 43 Craty|          smaller ones, or every part?~HERMOGENES: I should say that every
 44 Craty|             part smaller than a name?~HERMOGENES: No; that is the smallest.~
 45 Craty|              of the true proposition?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Yes, and
 46 Craty|              a true part, as you say.~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And is not
 47 Craty|           falsehood also a falsehood?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Then, if
 48 Craty|          names may be true and false?~HERMOGENES: So we must infer.~SOCRATES:
 49 Craty|               affirms to be the name?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And will
 50 Craty|            the time of uttering them?~HERMOGENES: Yes, Socrates, I can conceive
 51 Craty|          SOCRATES: But would you say, Hermogenes, that the things differ
 52 Craty|       permanent essence of their own?~HERMOGENES: There have been times,
 53 Craty|              such thing as a bad man?~HERMOGENES: No, indeed; but I have
 54 Craty|             found any very good ones?~HERMOGENES: Not many.~SOCRATES: Still
 55 Craty|            Still you have found them?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And would
 56 Craty|              Would that be your view?~HERMOGENES: It would.~SOCRATES: But
 57 Craty|               and some of us foolish?~HERMOGENES: Impossible.~SOCRATES: And
 58 Craty|        reality be wiser than another.~HERMOGENES: He cannot.~SOCRATES: Nor
 59 Craty|              to be attributed to all.~HERMOGENES: There cannot.~SOCRATES:
 60 Craty|        relation prescribed by nature.~HERMOGENES: I think, Socrates, that
 61 Craty|        actions also a class of being?~HERMOGENES: Yes, the actions are real
 62 Craty|              and be of no use at all.~HERMOGENES: I should say that the natural
 63 Craty|               the natural instrument.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And this
 64 Craty|            holds good of all actions?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And speech
 65 Craty|           speech is a kind of action?~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And will
 66 Craty|          result in error and failure.~HERMOGENES: I quite agree with you.~
 67 Craty|               giving names men speak.~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
 68 Craty|         naming also a sort of action?~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And we
 69 Craty|          special nature of their own?~HERMOGENES: Precisely.~SOCRATES: Then
 70 Craty|           shall we name with success.~HERMOGENES: I agree.~SOCRATES: But
 71 Craty|             to be cut with something?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And that
 72 Craty|               pierced with something?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
 73 Craty|              be named with something?~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: What is
 74 Craty|            that with which we pierce?~HERMOGENES: An awl.~SOCRATES: And with
 75 Craty|              And with which we weave?~HERMOGENES: A shuttle.~SOCRATES: And
 76 Craty|               And with which we name?~HERMOGENES: A name.~SOCRATES: Very
 77 Craty|              a name is an instrument?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: Suppose
 78 Craty|                A weaving instrument.’~HERMOGENES: Well.~SOCRATES: And I ask
 79 Craty|               the warp from the woof.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
 80 Craty|               instruments in general?~HERMOGENES: To be sure.~SOCRATES: And
 81 Craty|           what do we do when we name?~HERMOGENES: I cannot say.~SOCRATES:
 82 Craty|           according to their natures?~HERMOGENES: Certainly we do.~SOCRATES:
 83 Craty|               the threads of the web.~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And the
 84 Craty|             instrument of the weaver?~HERMOGENES: Assuredly.~SOCRATES: Then
 85 Craty|            well means like a teacher?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And when
 86 Craty|           work will he be using well?~HERMOGENES: That of the carpenter.~
 87 Craty|       carpenter, or the skilled only?~HERMOGENES: Only the skilled.~SOCRATES:
 88 Craty|           work will he be using well?~HERMOGENES: That of the smith.~SOCRATES:
 89 Craty|           smith, or only the skilled?~HERMOGENES: The skilled only.~SOCRATES:
 90 Craty|          whose work will he be using?~HERMOGENES: There again I am puzzled.~
 91 Craty|               the names which we use?~HERMOGENES: Indeed I cannot.~SOCRATES:
 92 Craty|               to you to give us them?~HERMOGENES: Yes, I suppose so.~SOCRATES:
 93 Craty|               work of the legislator?~HERMOGENES: I agree.~SOCRATES: And
 94 Craty|      legislator, or the skilled only?~HERMOGENES: The skilled only.~SOCRATES:
 95 Craty|         skilled only.~SOCRATES: Then, Hermogenes, not every man is able to
 96 Craty|              the world is the rarest.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And how
 97 Craty|           fitted to act as a shuttle?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
 98 Craty|              which he made the other?~HERMOGENES: To the latter, I should
 99 Craty|            the true or ideal shuttle?~HERMOGENES: I think so.~SOCRATES: And
100 Craty|          maker produces in each case.~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And the
101 Craty|         nature to their several uses?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
102 Craty|              by nature to their uses?~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: For the
103 Craty|               instruments in general.~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Then, as
104 Craty|               there is no difference.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
105 Craty|              country makes no matter.~HERMOGENES: Quite true.~SOCRATES: But
106 Craty|            weaver who is to use them?~HERMOGENES: I should say, he who is
107 Craty|               being well done or not?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
108 Craty|              SOCRATES: And who is he?~HERMOGENES: The player of the lyre.~
109 Craty|           will direct the shipwright?~HERMOGENES: The pilot.~SOCRATES: And
110 Craty|              not the user be the man?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And this
111 Craty|           knows how to ask questions?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And how
112 Craty|               And how to answer them?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And him
113 Craty|            would call a dialectician?~HERMOGENES: Yes; that would be his
114 Craty|            rudder is to be well made.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And the
115 Craty|              are to be rightly given?~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
116 Craty|              is true.~SOCRATES: Then, Hermogenes, I should say that this
117 Craty|             in letters and syllables.~HERMOGENES: I cannot answer you, Socrates;
118 Craty|              names.~SOCRATES: My good Hermogenes, I have none to show. Was
119 Craty|               to give a thing a name.~HERMOGENES: Very good.~SOCRATES: And
120 Craty|           know, is the next question.~HERMOGENES: Certainly, I care to know.~
121 Craty|               SOCRATES: Then reflect.~HERMOGENES: How shall I reflect?~SOCRATES:
122 Craty|           about the fitness of names.~HERMOGENES: But how inconsistent should
123 Craty|               of Homer and the poets.~HERMOGENES: And where does Homer say
124 Craty|           names; do you not think so?~HERMOGENES: Why, of course they call
125 Craty|              and men call Scamander.’~HERMOGENES: I remember.~SOCRATES: Well,
126 Craty|               to which I refer? (Il.)~HERMOGENES: I do.~SOCRATES: Let me
127 Craty|              Astyanax or Scamandrius?~HERMOGENES: I do not know.~SOCRATES:
128 Craty|         likely to give correct names?~HERMOGENES: I should say the wise,
129 Craty|          taken as a class, the wiser?~HERMOGENES: I should say, the men.~
130 Craty|            given to him by the women.~HERMOGENES: That may be inferred.~SOCRATES:
131 Craty|               wiser than their wives?~HERMOGENES: To be sure.~SOCRATES: Then
132 Craty|             the boy than Scamandrius?~HERMOGENES: Clearly.~SOCRATES: And
133 Craty|            saving, as Homer observes.~HERMOGENES: I see.~SOCRATES: Why, Hermogenes,
134 Craty|     HERMOGENES: I see.~SOCRATES: Why, Hermogenes, I do not as yet see myself;
135 Craty|               see myself; and do you?~HERMOGENES: No, indeed; not I.~SOCRATES:
136 Craty|            also give Hector his name?~HERMOGENES: What of that?~SOCRATES:
137 Craty|             the correctness of names.~HERMOGENES: I assure you that I think
138 Craty|         things. Do you agree with me?~HERMOGENES: Yes, I agree.~SOCRATES:
139 Craty|               name and appears in it.~HERMOGENES: What do you mean?~SOCRATES:
140 Craty|               give the letters names.~HERMOGENES: I believe you are right.~
141 Craty|        meaning. Would you not say so?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: The same
142 Craty|              in the course of nature?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And what
143 Craty|               a horse foaling a calf.~HERMOGENES: Quite true.~SOCRATES: Then
144 Craty|         should be called irreligious?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: He
145 Craty|             have an opposite meaning.~HERMOGENES: Certainly, Socrates.~SOCRATES:
146 Craty|            Socrates.~SOCRATES: Again, Hermogenes, there is Orestes (the man
147 Craty|        wildness of his hero’s nature.~HERMOGENES: That is very likely, Socrates.~
148 Craty|             also according to nature.~HERMOGENES: Clearly.~SOCRATES: Yes,
149 Craty|               only (o ta pelas oron).~HERMOGENES: How so?~SOCRATES: Because,
150 Craty|        traditions about him are true.~HERMOGENES: And what are the traditions?~
151 Craty|             not hold good to the end.~HERMOGENES: You seem to me, Socrates,
152 Craty|               oracles.~SOCRATES: Yes, Hermogenes, and I believe that I caught
153 Craty|           purifications of this sort.~HERMOGENES: With all my heart; for
154 Craty|    occasionally in giving them names.~HERMOGENES: I think so, Socrates.~SOCRATES:
155 Craty|               are rightly named Gods?~HERMOGENES: Yes, that will be well.~
156 Craty|             Do you think that likely?~HERMOGENES: I think it very likely
157 Craty|           What shall follow the Gods?~HERMOGENES: Must not demons and heroes
158 Craty|               me if my view is right.~HERMOGENES: Let me hear.~SOCRATES:
159 Craty|             how Hesiod uses the word?~HERMOGENES: I do not.~SOCRATES: Do
160 Craty|           race of men who came first?~HERMOGENES: Yes, I do.~SOCRATES: He
161 Craty|              Hesiod, Works and Days.)~HERMOGENES: What is the inference?~
162 Craty|            that we are the iron race.~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
163 Craty|            said to be of golden race?~HERMOGENES: Very likely.~SOCRATES:
164 Craty|            And are not the good wise?~HERMOGENES: Yes, they are wise.~SOCRATES:
165 Craty|               rightly called a demon.~HERMOGENES: Then I rather think that
166 Craty|               they were born of love.~HERMOGENES: What do you mean?~SOCRATES:
167 Craty|              the heroes are demigods?~HERMOGENES: What then?~SOCRATES: All
168 Craty|               that is more difficult.~HERMOGENES: No, I cannot; and I would
169 Craty|             inspiration of Euthyphro.~HERMOGENES: Of course.~SOCRATES: Your
170 Craty|               the place of the grave.~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
171 Craty|              been changed to a grave.~HERMOGENES: What do you mean?~SOCRATES:
172 Craty|            meaning anathron a opopen.~HERMOGENES: May I ask you to examine
173 Craty|         curious?~SOCRATES: Certainly.~HERMOGENES: I will take that which
174 Craty|            body?~SOCRATES: Of course.~HERMOGENES: Let us endeavour to analyze
175 Craty|              of the word soma (body)?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: If I am
176 Craty|           What do you say to another?~HERMOGENES: Let me hear.~SOCRATES:
177 Craty|               What else but the soul?~HERMOGENES: Just that.~SOCRATES: And
178 Craty|              principle of all things?~HERMOGENES: Yes; I do.~SOCRATES: Then
179 Craty|             refined away into psuche.~HERMOGENES: Certainly; and this derivation
180 Craty|             true meaning of the name.~HERMOGENES: But what shall we say of
181 Craty|             You mean soma (the body).~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: That may
182 Craty|             the word need be changed.~HERMOGENES: I think, Socrates, that
183 Craty|                SOCRATES: Yes, indeed, Hermogenes; and there is one excellent
184 Craty|             there can be small blame.~HERMOGENES: I think, Socrates, that
185 Craty|          Hestia, according to custom?~HERMOGENES: Yes, that will be very
186 Craty|             who gave the name Hestia?~HERMOGENES: That is another and certainly
187 Craty|           question.~SOCRATES: My dear Hermogenes, the first imposers of names
188 Craty|               had a good deal to say.~HERMOGENES: Well, and what of them?~
189 Craty|               talking great nonsense.~HERMOGENES: Why, Socrates?~SOCRATES:
190 Craty|          discovered a hive of wisdom.~HERMOGENES: Of what nature?~SOCRATES:
191 Craty|        ridiculous, and yet plausible.~HERMOGENES: How plausible?~SOCRATES:
192 Craty|               which Homer also spoke.~HERMOGENES: How do you mean?~SOCRATES:
193 Craty|            into the same water twice.~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
194 Craty|             direction of Heracleitus.~HERMOGENES: I think that there is something
195 Craty|           made up of these two words.~HERMOGENES: The idea is ingenious,
196 Craty|               of Zeus we have spoken.~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Then let
197 Craty|            that or by his other name.~HERMOGENES: By all means.~SOCRATES:
198 Craty|           call the God Pluto instead.~HERMOGENES: And what is the true derivation?~
199 Craty|            the God really correspond.~HERMOGENES: Why, how is that?~SOCRATES:
200 Craty|            spot,—desire or necessity?~HERMOGENES: Desire, Socrates, is stronger
201 Craty|              the strongest of chains?~HERMOGENES: Assuredly they would.~SOCRATES:
202 Craty|          infer, and not by necessity?~HERMOGENES: That is clear.~SOCRATES:
203 Craty|               there are many desires?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And therefore
204 Craty|          chain is to be the greatest?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: And is any
205 Craty|             associating with another?~HERMOGENES: Certainly not.~SOCRATES:
206 Craty|               is not that the reason, Hermogenes, why no one, who has been
207 Craty|             his own far-famed chains.~HERMOGENES: There is a deal of truth
208 Craty|               you say.~SOCRATES: Yes, Hermogenes, and the legislator called
209 Craty|         eidenai) of all noble things.~HERMOGENES: Very good; and what do
210 Craty|               you remarked this fact?~HERMOGENES: To be sure I have, and
211 Craty|              of the power of the God.~HERMOGENES: How so?~SOCRATES: I will
212 Craty|            and medicine, and archery.~HERMOGENES: That must be a strange
213 Craty|           pure both in body and soul.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
214 Craty|         absolver from all impurities?~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: Then
215 Craty|              or all of these reasons.~HERMOGENES: What is the meaning of
216 Craty|              the authority of Hesiod.~HERMOGENES: Still there remains Athene,
217 Craty|            not likely to forget them.~HERMOGENES: No, indeed.~SOCRATES: There
218 Craty|          other appellation of Athene.~HERMOGENES: What other appellation?~
219 Craty|         SOCRATES: We call her Pallas.~HERMOGENES: To be sure.~SOCRATES: And
220 Craty|        shaking (pallein), or dancing.~HERMOGENES: That is quite true.~SOCRATES:
221 Craty|       explanation of the name Pallas?~HERMOGENES: Yes; but what do you say
222 Craty|               name?~SOCRATES: Athene?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: That is
223 Craty|                and called her Athene.~HERMOGENES: But what do you say of
224 Craty|             of light (Phaeos istora)?~HERMOGENES: Surely.~SOCRATES: Ephaistos
225 Craty|           that is obvious to anybody.~HERMOGENES: That is very probable,
226 Craty|               the derivation of Ares.~HERMOGENES: What is Ares?~SOCRATES:
227 Craty|        appropriate to the God of war.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
228 Craty|              of Euthyphro can prance.~HERMOGENES: Only one more God! I should
229 Craty|          because she was a messenger.~HERMOGENES: Then I am very sure that
230 Craty|          double-formed son of Hermes.~HERMOGENES: How do you make that out?~
231 Craty|            two forms, true and false?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: Is
232 Craty|         tragedy is the place of them?~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: Then
233 Craty|              as I was saying, my dear Hermogenes, let us get away from the
234 Craty|               get away from the Gods.~HERMOGENES: From these sort of Gods,
235 Craty|              wish, I will not refuse.~HERMOGENES: You will oblige me.~SOCRATES:
236 Craty|              mentioned first—the sun?~HERMOGENES: Very good.~SOCRATES: The
237 Craty|             productions of the earth.~HERMOGENES: But what is selene (the
238 Craty|           unfortunate for Anaxagoras.~HERMOGENES: How so?~SOCRATES: The word
239 Craty|               her light from the sun.~HERMOGENES: Why do you say so?~SOCRATES:
240 Craty|           have much the same meaning?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: This light
241 Craty|          light of the previous month.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: The
242 Craty|         unfrequently called selanaia.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: And as
243 Craty|               shape becomes selanaia.~HERMOGENES: A real dithyrambic sort
244 Craty|              eyes (anastrephein opa).~HERMOGENES: What do you say of pur (
245 Craty|              difficulty of this sort.~HERMOGENES: What is it?~SOCRATES: I
246 Craty|               the meaning of the pur?~HERMOGENES: Indeed I cannot.~SOCRATES:
247 Craty|             often borrowed from them.~HERMOGENES: What is the inference?~
248 Craty|         rather likely to be at fault.~HERMOGENES: Yes, certainly.~SOCRATES:
249 Craty|                 and many other words.~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
250 Craty|              pur and udor. Aer (air), Hermogenes, may be explained as the
251 Craty|           gegaasi means gegennesthai.~HERMOGENES: Good.~SOCRATES: What shall
252 Craty|              What shall we take next?~HERMOGENES: There are orai (the seasons),
253 Craty|              of a single proposition.~HERMOGENES: Indeed, Socrates, you make
254 Craty|         SOCRATES: I am run away with.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: But
255 Craty|               yet at my utmost speed.~HERMOGENES: I should like very much
256 Craty|              words, as you call them?~HERMOGENES: Surely, we must not leave
257 Craty|               making this reflection.~HERMOGENES: How is that, Socrates?~
258 Craty|             is most surely indicated.~HERMOGENES: No, indeed, I never thought
259 Craty|            name indicative of motion.~HERMOGENES: What was the name?~SOCRATES:
260 Craty|             nature of justice; but I, Hermogenes, being an enthusiastic disciple,
261 Craty|               which I have mentioned.~HERMOGENES: I think, Socrates, that
262 Craty|           SOCRATES: And not the rest?~HERMOGENES: Hardly.~SOCRATES: Well,
263 Craty|         things flourish (tethelenai).~HERMOGENES: That is surely probable.~
264 Craty|           have still to be explained.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: There is
265 Craty|            techne (art), for example.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: That
266 Craty|               between the nu and eta.~HERMOGENES: That is a very shabby etymology.~
267 Craty|             there are other examples.~HERMOGENES: That is quite true, Socrates.~
268 Craty|             be adapted to any object.~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: Yes, that
269 Craty|           moderation and probability.~HERMOGENES: Such is my desire.~SOCRATES:
270 Craty|              SOCRATES: And mine, too, Hermogenes. But do not be too much
271 Craty|             then arete is also right.~HERMOGENES: But what is the meaning
272 Craty|               to my ingenious device.~HERMOGENES: What device?~SOCRATES:
273 Craty|               give to this word also.~HERMOGENES: Very likely you are right;
274 Craty|               together into aischron.~HERMOGENES: But what do you say of
275 Craty|         omicron upsilon into omicron.~HERMOGENES: What do you mean?~SOCRATES:
276 Craty|               appears to denote mind.~HERMOGENES: How so?~SOCRATES: Let me
277 Craty|           imposes the name the cause?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: And
278 Craty|                or of men, or of both?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Is not mind
279 Craty|           mind the beautiful (kalon)?~HERMOGENES: That is evident.~SOCRATES:
280 Craty|          other works worthy of blame?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: Physic
281 Craty|             the works of a carpenter?~HERMOGENES: Exactly.~SOCRATES: And
282 Craty|             does the works of beauty?~HERMOGENES: Of course.~SOCRATES: And
283 Craty|       principle we affirm to be mind?~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: Then
284 Craty|            speak of as the beautiful?~HERMOGENES: That is evident.~SOCRATES:
285 Craty|              more names remain to us?~HERMOGENES: There are the words which
286 Craty|         carried round with the world.~HERMOGENES: That is probable.~SOCRATES:
287 Craty|               nu, and so made kerdos.~HERMOGENES: Well, but what is lusiteloun (
288 Craty|     profitable)?~SOCRATES: I suppose, Hermogenes, that people do not mean
289 Craty|              has a foreign character.~HERMOGENES: And what do you say of
290 Craty|              think that I need speak.~HERMOGENES: Which are they?~SOCRATES:
291 Craty| unadvantageous), akerdes (ungainful).~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: I would
292 Craty|         harmful), zemiodes (hurtful).~HERMOGENES: Good.~SOCRATES: The word
293 Craty|               improved into blaberon.~HERMOGENES: You bring out curious results,
294 Craty|               the makers of the name, Hermogenes; not mine.~HERMOGENES: Very
295 Craty|           name, Hermogenes; not mine.~HERMOGENES: Very true; but what is
296 Craty|              zemiodes?—let me remark, Hermogenes, how right I was in saying
297 Craty|        language is clearly indicated.~HERMOGENES: What do you mean?~SOCRATES:
298 Craty|            the grandeur of the sound.~HERMOGENES: How do you mean?~SOCRATES:
299 Craty|          called by us emera (long e).~HERMOGENES: That is true.~SOCRATES:
300 Craty|           imera, from imeros, desire.~HERMOGENES: Clearly.~SOCRATES: But
301 Craty|             emera different accents).~HERMOGENES: Such is my view.~SOCRATES:
302 Craty|            said duogon and not zugon?~HERMOGENES: They did so.~SOCRATES:
303 Craty|          examples of similar changes.~HERMOGENES: There are.~SOCRATES: Proceeding
304 Craty|              own brother of blaberon.~HERMOGENES: Yes, Socrates; that is
305 Craty|            binds motion (dounti ion).~HERMOGENES: What do you say of edone (
306 Craty|             SOCRATES: I do not think, Hermogenes, that there is any great
307 Craty|             not give me another word?~HERMOGENES: What do you think of doxa (
308 Craty|               or proposal, or object.~HERMOGENES: You are quickening your
309 Craty|        persevere with your questions.~HERMOGENES: Well, then, let me ask
310 Craty|             word maiesthai (to seek)?~HERMOGENES: Yes;—meaning the same as
311 Craty|         oukion or ouki on = ouk ion).~HERMOGENES: You have hammered away
312 Craty|              how should I answer him?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: One way
313 Craty|               been already suggested.~HERMOGENES: What way?~SOCRATES: To
314 Craty|             to be a barbarous tongue.~HERMOGENES: Very likely.~SOCRATES:
315 Craty|               the enquiry in despair.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
316 Craty|              be resolved any further.~HERMOGENES: I believe you to be in
317 Craty|         according to some new method?~HERMOGENES: Very likely.~SOCRATES:
318 Craty|           likely.~SOCRATES: Quite so, Hermogenes; all that has preceded would
319 Craty|           principle of primary names.~HERMOGENES: Let me hear, and I will
320 Craty|             is no difference in them.~HERMOGENES: Certainly not.~SOCRATES:
321 Craty|        indicate the nature of things.~HERMOGENES: Of course.~SOCRATES: And
322 Craty|         implied in their being names.~HERMOGENES: Surely.~SOCRATES: But the
323 Craty|        significance from the primary.~HERMOGENES: That is evident.~SOCRATES:
324 Craty|             and the rest of the body?~HERMOGENES: There would be no choice,
325 Craty|             like as we could to them.~HERMOGENES: I do not see that we could
326 Craty|           body ever express anything.~HERMOGENES: Very true.~SOCRATES: And
327 Craty|             which we want to express.~HERMOGENES: It must be so, I think.~
328 Craty|           imitator names or imitates?~HERMOGENES: I think so.~SOCRATES: Nay,
329 Craty|             reached the truth as yet.~HERMOGENES: Why not?~SOCRATES: Because
330 Craty|              that which they imitate.~HERMOGENES: Quite true.~SOCRATES: Then
331 Craty|           right in what I was saying?~HERMOGENES: In my opinion, no. But
332 Craty|         figure, and many have colour?~HERMOGENES: Certainly.~SOCRATES: But
333 Craty|           them are music and drawing?~HERMOGENES: True.~SOCRATES: Again,
334 Craty|              said to have an essence?~HERMOGENES: I should think so.~SOCRATES:
335 Craty|             the nature of each thing?~HERMOGENES: Quite so.~SOCRATES: The
336 Craty|              this imitator be called?~HERMOGENES: I imagine, Socrates, that
337 Craty|           imitate the essence or not.~HERMOGENES: Very good.~SOCRATES: But
338 Craty|           names, or are there others?~HERMOGENES: There must be others.~SOCRATES:
339 Craty|             consideration of rhythms?~HERMOGENES: Yes.~SOCRATES: Must we
340 Craty|          composition of them, my dear Hermogenes, will be a sorry piece of
341 Craty|               in the wrong direction.~HERMOGENES: That, Socrates, I can quite
342 Craty|            certain that I should not.~HERMOGENES: Much less am I likely to
343 Craty|               can. What do you think?~HERMOGENES: I very much approve.~SOCRATES:
344 Craty|                may appear ridiculous, Hermogenes, but it cannot be avoided—
345 Craty|              suppose this to be true?~HERMOGENES: Certainly, Socrates.~SOCRATES:
346 Craty|            better which you may have.~HERMOGENES: Fear not; I will do my
347 Craty|               signs. That is my view, Hermogenes, of the truth of names;
348 Craty|             Cratylus has more to say.~HERMOGENES: But, Socrates, as I was
349 Craty|           CRATYLUS: Well, but surely, Hermogenes, you do not suppose that
350 Craty|             the very greatest of all.~HERMOGENES: No, indeed; but, as Hesiod
351 Craty|           Cratylus, in the view which Hermogenes and myself have worked out;
352 Craty|             to the name of our friend Hermogenes, which was mentioned before:—
353 Craty|         CRATYLUS: I should reply that Hermogenes is not his name at all,
354 Craty|             if a man were to call him Hermogenes, would he not be even speaking
355 Craty|              whether you can call him Hermogenes, if he is not.~CRATYLUS:
356 Craty|              Hail, Athenian stranger, Hermogenes, son of Smicrion’—these
357 Craty|            you but only to our friend Hermogenes, or perhaps to nobody at
358 Craty|             remember, was remarked by Hermogenes and myself in the particular
359 Craty|              you prefer the notion of Hermogenes and of many others, who
360 Craty|           invite you to consider what Hermogenes and I were saying about
361 Craty|            rho, as you were saying to Hermogenes and in my opinion rightly,
362 Craty|        dragging in of resemblance, as Hermogenes says, is a shabby thing,
363 Craty|             as you are intending, and Hermogenes shall set you on your way.~