(...) The Sophist
     Part
 501 Text |              nothing else to be said.~STRANGER: Again, false opinion is
 502 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: You mean to say that false
 503 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: Does false opinion think
 504 Text |          falsehood is to be possible.~STRANGER: And does not false opinion
 505 Text |              at all?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And here, again, is falsehood?~
 506 Text |            THEAETETUS: Falsehood—yes.~STRANGER: And in like manner, a false
 507 Text |          false proposition can arise.~STRANGER: There is not; but the Sophist
 508 Text |               an utter impossibility.~STRANGER: How well you remember!
 509 Text |          THEAETETUS: They are indeed.~STRANGER: We have gone through but
 510 Text |           possibly catch the Sophist.~STRANGER: Shall we then be so faint-hearted
 511 Text |              slightest hold upon him.~STRANGER: Will you then forgive me,
 512 Text |        THEAETETUS: To be sure I will.~STRANGER: I have a yet more urgent
 513 Text |                THEAETETUS: Which is—?~STRANGER: That you will promise not
 514 Text |       parricide.~THEAETETUS: And why?~STRANGER: Because, in self-defence,
 515 Text |               kind is clearly needed.~STRANGER: Yes, a blind man, as they
 516 Text |                THEAETETUS: Most true.~STRANGER: And therefore I must venture
 517 Text |              ever induce us to do so.~STRANGER: I have a third little request
 518 Text |               THEAETETUS: What is it?~STRANGER: You heard me say what I
 519 Text |          argument?~THEAETETUS: I did.~STRANGER: I tremble at the thought
 520 Text |               therefore, and proceed.~STRANGER: And where shall I begin
 521 Text |       THEAETETUS: Which?—Let me hear.~STRANGER: I think that we had better,
 522 Text |             distinctly what you mean.~STRANGER: I think that Parmenides,
 523 Text |              strain.~THEAETETUS: How?~STRANGER: As if we had been children,
 524 Text |               THEAETETUS: What thing?~STRANGER: That they went on their
 525 Text |          THEAETETUS: How do you mean?~STRANGER: I mean to say, that when
 526 Text |          about it.~THEAETETUS: I see.~STRANGER: And very likely we have
 527 Text |               THEAETETUS: I dare say.~STRANGER: And the same may be said
 528 Text |          mentioned.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: The consideration of most
 529 Text |             mean by the word ‘being.’~STRANGER: You follow close at my
 530 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: But perhaps you mean to
 531 Text |             THEAETETUS: Quite likely.~STRANGER: ‘Then, friends,’ we shall
 532 Text |                THEAETETUS: Most true.~STRANGER: ‘Since, then, we are in
 533 Text |            THEAETETUS: Certainly not.~STRANGER: And what about the assertors
 534 Text |             THEAETETUS: By all means.~STRANGER: Then let them answer this
 535 Text |              reply.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And there is something
 536 Text |            being’?~THEAETETUS: ‘Yes.’~STRANGER: And is being the same as
 537 Text |            What will be their answer, Stranger?~STRANGER: It is clear,
 538 Text |               their answer, Stranger?~STRANGER: It is clear, Theaetetus,
 539 Text |         question.~THEAETETUS: Why so?~STRANGER: To admit of two names,
 540 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And equally irrational
 541 Text |         anything?~THEAETETUS: How so?~STRANGER: To distinguish the name
 542 Text |             duality.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And yet he who identifies
 543 Text |               else.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And the one will turn out
 544 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And would they say that
 545 Text |             and they actually say so.~STRANGER: If being is a whole, as
 546 Text |              parts.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Yet that which has parts
 547 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: But that of which this
 548 Text |           unity?~THEAETETUS: Why not?~STRANGER: Because, according to right
 549 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: But this indivisible, if
 550 Text |             THEAETETUS: I understand.~STRANGER: Shall we say that being
 551 Text |            hard alternative to offer.~STRANGER: Most true; for being, having
 552 Text |            than one.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And yet if being be not
 553 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: Upon this view, again,
 554 Text |          not-being?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And, again, the all becomes
 555 Text |              nature.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: But if the whole does not
 556 Text |            being.~THEAETETUS: Why so?~STRANGER: Because that which comes
 557 Text |         certainly appears to be true.~STRANGER: Again; how can that which
 558 Text |        quantity.~THEAETETUS: Exactly.~STRANGER: And there will be innumerable
 559 Text |         greater and worse perplexity.~STRANGER: We are far from having
 560 Text |             we will go to the others.~STRANGER: There appears to be a sort
 561 Text |              THEAETETUS: How is that?~STRANGER: Some of them are dragging
 562 Text |            terrible fellows they are.~STRANGER: And that is the reason
 563 Text |            matters.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Let us ask each party in
 564 Text |          shall we get it out of them?~STRANGER: With those who make being
 565 Text |            must do?~THEAETETUS: What?~STRANGER: Let us, if we can, really
 566 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very good.~STRANGER: Then now, on the supposition
 567 Text |             them.~THEAETETUS: Agreed.~STRANGER: Let them say whether they
 568 Text |     THEAETETUS: Of course they would.~STRANGER: And do they not acknowledge
 569 Text |        THEAETETUS: Certainly they do.~STRANGER: Meaning to say that the
 570 Text |             exists?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And do they not say that
 571 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And that the just and wise
 572 Text |             THEAETETUS: Yes, they do.~STRANGER: But surely that which may
 573 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And, allowing that justice,
 574 Text |              any of them are visible.~STRANGER: And would they say that
 575 Text |              they were all corporeal.~STRANGER: Verily, Theaetetus, I perceive
 576 Text |             pretty much their notion.~STRANGER: Let us push the question;
 577 Text |                and we shall soon see.~STRANGER: My notion would be, that
 578 Text |         better of their own to offer.~STRANGER: Very good; perhaps we,
 579 Text |             them.~THEAETETUS: Agreed.~STRANGER: Let us now go to the friends
 580 Text |      interpreter.~THEAETETUS: I will.~STRANGER: To them we say—You would
 581 Text |        THEAETETUS: ‘Yes,’ they reply.~STRANGER: And you would allow that
 582 Text |             is what we should affirm.~STRANGER: Well, fair sirs, we say
 583 Text |          THEAETETUS: What definition?~STRANGER: We said that being was
 584 Text |             And what is their answer?~STRANGER: They deny the truth of
 585 Text |            THEAETETUS: What was that?~STRANGER: Any power of doing or suffering
 586 Text |              being?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: They deny this, and say
 587 Text |               truth in what they say?~STRANGER: Yes; but our reply will
 588 Text |               doubt that they say so.~STRANGER: And is knowing and being
 589 Text |           will contradict themselves.~STRANGER: I understand; but they
 590 Text |             affirm.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And, O heavens, can we
 591 Text |              dreadful thing to admit, Stranger.~STRANGER: But shall we
 592 Text |             thing to admit, Stranger.~STRANGER: But shall we say that has
 593 Text |     THEAETETUS: How is that possible?~STRANGER: Or shall we say that both
 594 Text |              way can it contain them?~STRANGER: Or that being has mind
 595 Text |               to me to be irrational.~STRANGER: Under being, then, we must
 596 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: Then, Theaetetus, our inference
 597 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: And yet this equally follows,
 598 Text |        existence.~THEAETETUS: How so?~STRANGER: Do you think that sameness
 599 Text |            THEAETETUS: Certainly not.~STRANGER: Can you see how without
 600 Text |             anywhere?~THEAETETUS: No.~STRANGER: And surely contend we must
 601 Text |              Yes, with all our might.~STRANGER: Then the philosopher, who
 602 Text |                THEAETETUS: Most true.~STRANGER: And now, do we seem to
 603 Text |                THEAETETUS: Yes truly.~STRANGER: Alas, Theaetetus, methinks
 604 Text |         THEAETETUS: What do you mean?~STRANGER: O my friend, do you not
 605 Text |               out our desperate case.~STRANGER: Reflect: after having made
 606 Text |               recall them to my mind?~STRANGER: To be sure I will, and
 607 Text |             get on.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Would you not say that
 608 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: And yet you would say that
 609 Text |            are?~THEAETETUS: I should.~STRANGER: And when you admit that
 610 Text |            THEAETETUS: Certainly not.~STRANGER: Or do you wish to imply
 611 Text |            THEAETETUS: Of course not.~STRANGER: Then you conceive of being
 612 Text |             that rest and motion are.~STRANGER: Then being is not the combination
 613 Text |       THEAETETUS: So it would appear.~STRANGER: Being, then, according
 614 Text |               is very much the truth.~STRANGER: Where, then, is a man to
 615 Text |            THEAETETUS: Where, indeed?~STRANGER: I scarcely think that he
 616 Text |       THEAETETUS: Utterly impossible.~STRANGER: Here, then, is another
 617 Text |               mind.~THEAETETUS: What?~STRANGER: When we were asked to what
 618 Text |               THEAETETUS: To be sure.~STRANGER: And are we not now in as
 619 Text |             THEAETETUS: I should say, Stranger, that we are in one which
 620 Text |               possible, even greater.~STRANGER: Then let us acknowledge
 621 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very good.~STRANGER: Let us enquire, then, how
 622 Text |          THEAETETUS: Give an example.~STRANGER: I mean that we speak of
 623 Text |             THEAETETUS: That is true.~STRANGER: And thus we provide a rich
 624 Text |        THEAETETUS: Certainly, I have.~STRANGER: Then, not to exclude any
 625 Text |           THEAETETUS: What questions?~STRANGER: Shall we refuse to attribute
 626 Text |             follow from each of them.~STRANGER: Very good, and first let
 627 Text |              THEAETETUS: They cannot.~STRANGER: But would either of them
 628 Text |             in being?~THEAETETUS: No.~STRANGER: Then by this admission
 629 Text |            rest.~THEAETETUS: Just so.~STRANGER: Again, those who would
 630 Text |          admixture.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Most ridiculous of all
 631 Text |            other.~THEAETETUS: Why so?~STRANGER: Why, because they are compelled
 632 Text |               and exact illustration.~STRANGER: And now, if we suppose
 633 Text |              I can solve that riddle.~STRANGER: How?~THEAETETUS: Why, because
 634 Text |            attributed to one another.~STRANGER: But this is utterly impossible.~
 635 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: Then only the third hypothesis
 636 Text |            remains.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: For, surely, either all
 637 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And two out of these three
 638 Text |          impossible.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Every one then, who desires
 639 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: This communion of some
 640 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: And the vowels, especially,
 641 Text |            another.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: But does every one know
 642 Text |          THEAETETUS: Art is required.~STRANGER: What art?~THEAETETUS: The
 643 Text |       THEAETETUS: The art of grammar.~STRANGER: And is not this also true
 644 Text |            musician?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And we shall find this
 645 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: And as classes are admitted
 646 Text |             greatest of all sciences.~STRANGER: How are we to call it?
 647 Text |         THEAETETUS: What do you mean?~STRANGER: Should we not say that
 648 Text |           That is what we should say.~STRANGER: Then, surely, he who can
 649 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: And the art of dialectic
 650 Text |             Who but he can be worthy?~STRANGER: In this region we shall
 651 Text |          THEAETETUS: For what reason?~STRANGER: Because the Sophist runs
 652 Text |        THEAETETUS: It seems to be so.~STRANGER: And the philosopher, always
 653 Text |           quite as true as the other.~STRANGER: Well, the philosopher may
 654 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very good.~STRANGER: Since, then, we are agreed
 655 Text |            THEAETETUS: We must do so.~STRANGER: The most important of all
 656 Text |              THEAETETUS: Yes, by far.~STRANGER: And two of these are, as
 657 Text |          THEAETETUS: Quite incapable.~STRANGER: Whereas being surely has
 658 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: That makes up three of
 659 Text |               THEAETETUS: To be sure.~STRANGER: And each of them is other
 660 Text |             itself.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: But then, what is the meaning
 661 Text |       THEAETETUS: Very likely we are.~STRANGER: But, surely, motion and
 662 Text |              THEAETETUS: How is that?~STRANGER: Whatever we attribute to
 663 Text |            them.~THEAETETUS: Why not?~STRANGER: Because motion would be
 664 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: Yet they surely both partake
 665 Text |               other?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Then we must not assert
 666 Text |          THEAETETUS: No; we must not.~STRANGER: But are we to conceive
 667 Text |      identical?~THEAETETUS: Possibly.~STRANGER: But if they are identical,
 668 Text |               Which surely cannot be.~STRANGER: Then being and the same
 669 Text |            one.~THEAETETUS: Scarcely.~STRANGER: Then we may suppose the
 670 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: And shall we call the other
 671 Text |              THEAETETUS: Very likely.~STRANGER: But you would agree, if
 672 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And the other is always
 673 Text |              other?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: But this would not be the
 674 Text |               true state of the case.~STRANGER: Then we must admit the
 675 Text |             classes.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And the fifth class pervades
 676 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: Then let us now put the
 677 Text |            the five.~THEAETETUS: How?~STRANGER: First there is motion,
 678 Text |            say?~THEAETETUS: It is so.~STRANGER: And therefore is not rest.~
 679 Text |            THEAETETUS: Certainly not.~STRANGER: And yet is, because partaking
 680 Text |              being.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Again, motion is other
 681 Text |            same?~THEAETETUS: Just so.~STRANGER: And is therefore not the
 682 Text |                THEAETETUS: It is not.~STRANGER: Yet, surely, motion is
 683 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: Then we must admit, and
 684 Text |               THEAETETUS: To be sure.~STRANGER: And if absolute motion
 685 Text |              another, and others not.~STRANGER: That such a communion of
 686 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: Let us proceed, then. May
 687 Text |          THEAETETUS: That is certain.~STRANGER: Then, according to this
 688 Text |              other?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: What is the next step?
 689 Text |              appeared to be just now.~STRANGER: Then we may without fear
 690 Text |               Without the least fear.~STRANGER: The plain result is that
 691 Text |               Nothing can be plainer.~STRANGER: Then not-being necessarily
 692 Text |         THEAETETUS: So we may assume.~STRANGER: Every class, then, has
 693 Text |         THEAETETUS: So we must infer.~STRANGER: And being itself may be
 694 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: Then we may infer that
 695 Text |               not far from the truth.~STRANGER: And we must not quarrel
 696 Text |                Nothing can be fairer.~STRANGER: Let me ask you to consider
 697 Text |            THEAETETUS: What question?~STRANGER: When we speak of not-being,
 698 Text |         THEAETETUS: What do you mean?~STRANGER: When we speak of something
 699 Text |            THEAETETUS: Certainly not.~STRANGER: The negative particles,
 700 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: There is another point
 701 Text |               THEAETETUS: What is it?~STRANGER: The nature of the other
 702 Text |        knowledge.~THEAETETUS: How so?~STRANGER: Knowledge, like the other,
 703 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: And is not the case the
 704 Text |             but will you tell me how?~STRANGER: There is some part of the
 705 Text |      beautiful?~THEAETETUS: There is.~STRANGER: Shall we say that this
 706 Text |              not than something else.~STRANGER: And now tell me another
 707 Text |              thing.~THEAETETUS: What?~STRANGER: Is the not-beautiful anything
 708 Text |          something?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Then the not-beautiful
 709 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: But upon this view, is
 710 Text |               THEAETETUS: Not at all.~STRANGER: And the not-great may be
 711 Text |               great?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And, in the same way, the
 712 Text |              other.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: The same may be said of
 713 Text |                THEAETETUS: Of course.~STRANGER: Then, as would appear,
 714 Text |          THEAETETUS: Beyond question.~STRANGER: What then shall we call
 715 Text |               compelled us to search.~STRANGER: And has not this, as you
 716 Text |            THEAETETUS: None whatever.~STRANGER: Do you observe that our
 717 Text |     prohibition?~THEAETETUS: In what?~STRANGER: We have advanced to a further
 718 Text |              THEAETETUS: How is that?~STRANGER: Why, because he says—~‘
 719 Text |          THEAETETUS: Yes, he says so.~STRANGER: Whereas, we have not only
 720 Text |               THEAETETUS: And surely, Stranger, we were quite right.~STRANGER:
 721 Text |        Stranger, we were quite right.~STRANGER: Let not any one say, then,
 722 Text |            are not.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And he who is sceptical
 723 Text |               THEAETETUS: What is it?~STRANGER: A thing of which I have
 724 Text |               THEAETETUS: To be sure.~STRANGER: For certainly, my friend,
 725 Text |             mind.~THEAETETUS: Why so?~STRANGER: The attempt at universal
 726 Text |             reason.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And, observe that we were
 727 Text |          another.~THEAETETUS: Why so?~STRANGER: Why, that we might be able
 728 Text |              the nature of discourse.~STRANGER: Perhaps you will see more
 729 Text |         THEAETETUS: What explanation?~STRANGER: Not-being has been acknowledged
 730 Text |              being.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And thence arises the question,
 731 Text |         language.~THEAETETUS: How so?~STRANGER: If not-being has no part
 732 Text |       THEAETETUS: That is quite true.~STRANGER: And where there is falsehood
 733 Text |              deceit.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And if there is deceit,
 734 Text |               THEAETETUS: To be sure.~STRANGER: Into that region the Sophist,
 735 Text |              being.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And now, not-being has
 736 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly, Stranger, there appears to be truth
 737 Text |               of defence without end.~STRANGER: Any one, Theaetetus, who
 738 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: Then, as I was saying,
 739 Text |              false.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Then, now, let us speak
 740 Text |        question at issue about names?~STRANGER: The question at issue is
 741 Text |             Clearly the last is true.~STRANGER: I understand you to say
 742 Text |      THEAETETUS: What are you saying?~STRANGER: What I thought that you
 743 Text |            THEAETETUS: What are they?~STRANGER: One of them is called nouns,
 744 Text |            THEAETETUS: Describe them.~STRANGER: That which denotes action
 745 Text |               verb.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And the other, which is
 746 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: A succession of nouns only
 747 Text |              I do not understand you.~STRANGER: I see that when you gave
 748 Text |         THEAETETUS: What do you mean?~STRANGER: I mean that words like ‘
 749 Text |             THEAETETUS: How can they?~STRANGER: Or, again, when you say ‘
 750 Text |              I ask, What do you mean?~STRANGER: When any one says ‘A man
 751 Text |           sentences?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Yes, for he now arrives
 752 Text |          discourse.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And as there are some things
 753 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: There is another small
 754 Text |               THEAETETUS: What is it?~STRANGER: A sentence must and cannot
 755 Text |            subject.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And must be of a certain
 756 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And now let us mind what
 757 Text |            THEAETETUS: We must do so.~STRANGER: I will repeat a sentence
 758 Text |              to the best of my power.~STRANGER: ‘Theaetetus sits’—not a
 759 Text |       sentence.~THEAETETUS: Not very.~STRANGER: Of whom does the sentence
 760 Text |              Of me; I am the subject.~STRANGER: Or this sentence, again—~
 761 Text |            THEAETETUS: What sentence?~STRANGER: ‘Theaetetus, with whom
 762 Text |               me, and to apply to me.~STRANGER: We agreed that every sentence
 763 Text |             quality.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And what is the quality
 764 Text |            false, and the other true.~STRANGER: The true says what is true
 765 Text |           about you?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And the false says what
 766 Text |           than true?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And therefore speaks of
 767 Text |               were?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And say that things are
 768 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: The second of the two sentences
 769 Text |          implied in recent admission.~STRANGER: And, in the second place,
 770 Text |             subject?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Who must be you, and can
 771 Text |           THEAETETUS: Unquestionably.~STRANGER: And it would be no sentence
 772 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: When other, then, is asserted
 773 Text |                THEAETETUS: Most true.~STRANGER: And therefore thought,
 774 Text |            false.~THEAETETUS: How so?~STRANGER: You will know better if
 775 Text |            you would wish me to gain.~STRANGER: Are not thought and speech
 776 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: But the stream of thought
 777 Text |             speech?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And we know that there
 778 Text |              THEAETETUS: What exists?~STRANGER: Affirmation.~THEAETETUS:
 779 Text |          THEAETETUS: Yes, we know it.~STRANGER: When the affirmation or
 780 Text |           There can be no other name.~STRANGER: And when opinion is presented,
 781 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: And seeing that language
 782 Text |                THEAETETUS: Certainly.~STRANGER: Do you perceive, then,
 783 Text |               THEAETETUS: I perceive.~STRANGER: Then let us not be discouraged
 784 Text |      THEAETETUS: What classification?~STRANGER: We divided image-making
 785 Text |         phantastic.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And we said that we were
 786 Text |            THEAETETUS: We did say so.~STRANGER: And our heads began to
 787 Text |          falsehood.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And now, since there has
 788 Text |           THEAETETUS: Quite possible.~STRANGER: And we have already admitted,
 789 Text | likeness-making art?~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Let us, then, renew the
 790 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very good.~STRANGER: You may remember that all
 791 Text |         acquisitive.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And the Sophist was flitting
 792 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: But now that the imitative
 793 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: In the first place, there
 794 Text |            THEAETETUS: What are they?~STRANGER: One of them is human and
 795 Text |          THEAETETUS: I do not follow.~STRANGER: Every power, as you may
 796 Text |               THEAETETUS: I remember.~STRANGER: Looking, now, at the world
 797 Text |               THEAETETUS: What is it?~STRANGER: The opinion that nature
 798 Text |              defer to your authority.~STRANGER: Nobly said, Theaetetus,
 799 Text |             divine.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Then, now, subdivide each
 800 Text |          THEAETETUS: How do you mean?~STRANGER: I mean to say that you
 801 Text |           THEAETETUS: I have done so.~STRANGER: Then, now, there are in
 802 Text |             divine.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And, again, in the division
 803 Text |              the divisions once more.~STRANGER: I suppose that we, and
 804 Text |             of God.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: And there are images of
 805 Text |            THEAETETUS: What are they?~STRANGER: The appearances which spring
 806 Text |            the work of a divine hand.~STRANGER: And what shall we say of
 807 Text |               THEAETETUS: Quite true.~STRANGER: And other products of human
 808 Text |             of a kind of similitudes.~STRANGER: And let us not forget that
 809 Text |               being.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: And this appeared to be
 810 Text |             as two.~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Then, now, let us again
 811 Text |           shall we make the division?~STRANGER: There is one kind which
 812 Text |         THEAETETUS: What do you mean?~STRANGER: When any one makes himself
 813 Text |      phantastic art.~THEAETETUS: Yes.~STRANGER: Let this, then, be named
 814 Text |              one and leave the other.~STRANGER: There is a further distinction,
 815 Text |              THEAETETUS: Let me hear.~STRANGER: There are some who imitate,
 816 Text |              There can be no greater.~STRANGER: Was not the sort of imitation
 817 Text |                THEAETETUS: Naturally.~STRANGER: And what would you say
 818 Text |             Yes, that is very common.~STRANGER: And do they always fail
 819 Text |        THEAETETUS: The very opposite.~STRANGER: Such a one, then, should
 820 Text |              knows?~THEAETETUS: True.~STRANGER: Can we find a suitable
 821 Text |       imitation.~THEAETETUS: Granted.~STRANGER: The former is our present
 822 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very true.~STRANGER: Let us, then, examine our
 823 Text |       THEAETETUS: Let us examine him.~STRANGER: Indeed there is a very
 824 Text |             kinds which you describe.~STRANGER: Shall we regard one as
 825 Text |                THEAETETUS: Very good.~STRANGER: And shall we further speak
 826 Text |          THEAETETUS: Answer yourself.~STRANGER: Upon consideration, then,
 827 Text |            What you say is most true.~STRANGER: And who is the maker of
 828 Text |               THEAETETUS: The latter.~STRANGER: And what shall we call
 829 Text |            the true and very Sophist.~STRANGER: Shall we bind up his name
 830 Text |             THEAETETUS: By all means.~STRANGER: He, then, who traces the


The Statesman
     Part
 831 Intro|       dialectical errors. The Eleatic stranger, here, as in the Sophist,
 832 Intro|    acquaintance of Theaetetus and the Stranger.~THEODORUS: And you will
 833 Intro|               you, I must request the Stranger to finish the argument...~
 834 Intro|            finish the argument...~The Stranger suggests that Theaetetus
 835 Intro|             form (compare Soph.).~The Stranger begins the enquiry by making
 836 Intro|               any picture. ‘But what, Stranger, is the deficiency of which
 837 Intro|              them all.~‘Your picture, Stranger, of the king and statesman,
 838 Intro|               better than the Eleatic Stranger in the words—‘The higher
 839 Intro|              to find that the Eleatic Stranger discourses to us, not only
 840 Intro|              of them; and the Eleatic Stranger takes up a position similar
 841 Intro|               to that of the Athenian Stranger in the Laws.~VII. There
 842 Text |      Theodorus, Socrates, The Eleatic Stranger, The Younger Socrates.~SOCRATES:
 843 Text |              of Theaetetus and of the Stranger.~THEODORUS: And in a little
 844 Text |                but I must now ask the Stranger, who will not, I hope, tire
 845 Text |    Philosopher, whichever he prefers.~STRANGER: That is my duty, Theodorus;
 846 Text |           THEODORUS: In what respect?~STRANGER: Shall we relieve him, and
 847 Text |              rest.~SOCRATES: I think, Stranger, that both of them may be
 848 Text |            to-day let him answer you.~STRANGER: Very good. Young Socrates,
 849 Text |      proposing?~YOUNG SOCRATES: I do.~STRANGER: And do you agree to his
 850 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: As you do not object, still
 851 Text |         science.~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: Then the sciences must
 852 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: I dare say.~STRANGER: But yet the division will
 853 Text |             YOUNG SOCRATES: How then?~STRANGER: They will be divided at
 854 Text |           point.~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: Where shall we discover
 855 Text |            the path is your business, Stranger, and not mine.~STRANGER:
 856 Text |               Stranger, and not mine.~STRANGER: Yes, Socrates, but the
 857 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very good.~STRANGER: Well, and are not arithmetic
 858 Text |         action?~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: But in the art of carpentering
 859 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: Then let us divide sciences
 860 Text |          science, which is one whole.~STRANGER: And are ‘statesman,’ ‘king,’ ‘
 861 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Let me hear.~STRANGER: If any one who is in a
 862 Text |       physician?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: And if any one who is in
 863 Text |           have?~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: But surely the science
 864 Text |         science?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: And will not he who possesses
 865 Text |             He certainly ought to be.~STRANGER: And the householder and
 866 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Of course.~STRANGER: Again, a large household
 867 Text |              SOCRATES: They will not.~STRANGER: Then, returning to the
 868 Text |              SOCRATES: Certainly not.~STRANGER: This too, is evident, that
 869 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Clearly not.~STRANGER: Then, shall we say that
 870 Text |           SOCRATES: Certainly he has.~STRANGER: Then we may put all together
 871 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: Clearly.~STRANGER: And now we shall only be
 872 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very good.~STRANGER: Think whether you can find
 873 Text |       SOCRATES: Tell me of what sort.~STRANGER: Such as this: You may remember
 874 Text |     calculation?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: Which was, unmistakeably,
 875 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: And to this art of calculation
 876 Text |               SOCRATES: How could we?~STRANGER: You know that the master-builder
 877 Text |         workmen?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: He contributes knowledge,
 878 Text |         labour?~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: And may therefore be justly
 879 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: Quite true.~STRANGER: But he ought not, like
 880 Text |           work.~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: Are not all such sciences,
 881 Text |            SOCRATES: That is evident.~STRANGER: May we not very properly
 882 Text |          SOCRATES: I should think so.~STRANGER: And when men have anything
 883 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: Then while we are at unity
 884 Text |              SOCRATES: Certainly not.~STRANGER: And now, in which of these
 885 Text |        SOCRATES: The latter, clearly.~STRANGER: Then we must see whether
 886 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: How is this?~STRANGER: Why, does not the retailer
 887 Text |          SOCRATES: Certainly he does.~STRANGER: And is not the herald under
 888 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: Then shall we mingle the
 889 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very good.~STRANGER: Thus a very fair distinction
 890 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: I think that it does; and
 891 Text |              SOCRATES: At what point?~STRANGER: May not all rulers be supposed
 892 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: Nor is there any difficulty
 893 Text |            How would you divide them?~STRANGER: Of the whole class, some
 894 Text |           life.~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: And by the help of this
 895 Text |              SOCRATES: At what point?~STRANGER: One part may be set over
 896 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: That division, then, is
 897 Text |               two halves do you mean?~STRANGER: Of course that which exercises
 898 Text |         beings.~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: And the breeding and tending
 899 Text |         flocks?~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: But the statesman is not
 900 Text |            Yes, I see, thanks to you.~STRANGER: Shall we call this art
 901 Text |               course of conversation.~STRANGER: Very good, Socrates; and,
 902 Text |            men and another of beasts.~STRANGER: You have certainly divided
 903 Text |          SOCRATES: What is the error?~STRANGER: I think that we had better
 904 Text |           SOCRATES: What do you mean, Stranger?~STRANGER: I will endeavour
 905 Text |           What do you mean, Stranger?~STRANGER: I will endeavour to speak
 906 Text |               in our recent division?~STRANGER: The error was just as if
 907 Text |             be made somewhat plainer.~STRANGER: O Socrates, best of men,
 908 Text |        declare—~YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: That a class and a part
 909 Text |                What did I hear, then?~STRANGER: That a class is necessarily
 910 Text |             YOUNG SOCRATES: So be it.~STRANGER: There is another thing
 911 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: What is it?~STRANGER: The point at which we digressed;
 912 Text |          other.~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: I thought that in taking
 913 Text |         SOCRATES: That again is true.~STRANGER: Suppose now, O most courageous
 914 Text |         SOCRATES: How can we be safe?~STRANGER: If we do not divide the
 915 Text |            better not take the whole?~STRANGER: Yes, there lay the source
 916 Text |        division.~YOUNG SOCRATES: How?~STRANGER: You remember how that part
 917 Text |           herds?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: In that case, there was
 918 Text |           wild.~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: And the political science
 919 Text |         animals.~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: But then we ought not to
 920 Text |            SOCRATES: What misfortune?~STRANGER: The misfortune of too much
 921 Text |         SOCRATES: And all the better, Stranger;—we got what we deserved.~
 922 Text |              we got what we deserved.~STRANGER: Very well: Let us then
 923 Text |           then—~YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: Have you ever heard, as
 924 Text |           heard the others described.~STRANGER: And you may have heard
 925 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: I asked you, because here
 926 Text |             YOUNG SOCRATES: There is.~STRANGER: And do you agree that we
 927 Text |           herds?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: There is surely no need
 928 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: Any one can divide the
 929 Text |            How would you divide them?~STRANGER: I should distinguish between
 930 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Most true.~STRANGER: And where shall we look
 931 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: The art of managing the
 932 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: Clearly.~STRANGER: Let me note that here appear
 933 Text |             Cannot we have both ways?~STRANGER: Together? What a thing
 934 Text |            like to have them in turn.~STRANGER: There will be no difficulty,
 935 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Let me hear.~STRANGER: The tame walking herding
 936 Text |        SOCRATES: Upon what principle?~STRANGER: The one grows horns; and
 937 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: Clearly.~STRANGER: Suppose that you divide
 938 Text |           must I speak of them, then?~STRANGER: In this way: let the science
 939 Text |             may therefore be assumed.~STRANGER: The king is clearly the
 940 Text |            SOCRATES: That is evident.~STRANGER: Shall we break up this
 941 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: Shall we distinguish them
 942 Text |           mean.~YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: I mean that horses and
 943 Text |         another.~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: But the remainder of the
 944 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: And of which has the Statesman
 945 Text |               Clearly of the unmixed.~STRANGER: I suppose that we must
 946 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: We must.~STRANGER: Every tame and herding
 947 Text |            the two remaining species?~STRANGER: There is a measure of difference
 948 Text |               SOCRATES: What is that?~STRANGER: The diameter; and, again,
 949 Text |           SOCRATES: What do you mean?~STRANGER: How does man walk, but
 950 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: Just so.~STRANGER: And the power of the remaining
 951 Text |         pretty nearly understand you.~STRANGER: In these divisions, Socrates,
 952 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: What is it?~STRANGER: Human beings have come
 953 Text |            very singular coincidence.~STRANGER: And would you not expect
 954 Text |            SOCRATES: Indeed I should.~STRANGER: And there is a still more
 955 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: Then here, Socrates, is
 956 Text |                 YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: That the dialectical method
 957 Text |              YOUNG SOCRATES: Clearly.~STRANGER: And now, I will not wait
 958 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: I say that we should have
 959 Text |         interest. (Compare Republic.)~STRANGER: Then now, let us go back
 960 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: The science of pure knowledge
 961 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: To be sure.~STRANGER: And do you think, Socrates,
 962 Text |            say?~YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: Do you think, I mean, that
 963 Text |        SOCRATES: I do not understand.~STRANGER: I will try to make the
 964 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Let me hear.~STRANGER: There were many arts of
 965 Text |            herd?~YOUNG SOCRATES: Yes.~STRANGER: And this the argument defined
 966 Text |   collectively?~YOUNG SOCRATES: True.~STRANGER: Note, however, a difference
 967 Text |       SOCRATES: To what do you refer?~STRANGER: I want to ask, whether
 968 Text |           SOCRATES: What do you mean?~STRANGER: I mean to say that merchants,
 969 Text |               not right in saying so?~STRANGER: Very likely they may be,
 970 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: But if this is as you say,
 971 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: Surely not.~STRANGER: Had we not reason just
 972 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: And that, Socrates, is
 973 Text |            must certainly avoid that.~STRANGER: Then let us make a new
 974 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: What road?~STRANGER: I think that we may have
 975 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: Listen, then, to a tale
 976 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Let me hear.~STRANGER: There did really happen,
 977 Text |             birth of the golden lamb.~STRANGER: No, not that; but another
 978 Text |            there is that legend also.~STRANGER: Again, we have been often
 979 Text |            SOCRATES: Yes, very often.~STRANGER: Did you ever hear that
 980 Text |             is another old tradition.~STRANGER: All these stories, and
 981 Text |                and leave out nothing.~STRANGER: Listen, then. There is
 982 Text |          YOUNG SOCRATES: Why is that?~STRANGER: Why, because only the most
 983 Text |               very reasonable indeed.~STRANGER: Let us now reflect and
 984 Text |           this.~YOUNG SOCRATES: What?~STRANGER: The reversal which takes
 985 Text |                How is that the cause?~STRANGER: Of all changes of the heavenly
 986 Text |        SOCRATES: I should imagine so.~STRANGER: And it may be supposed
 987 Text |        changes would naturally occur.~STRANGER: And animals, as we know,
 988 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: Hence there necessarily
 989 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: What is it?~STRANGER: The life of all animals
 990 Text |             YOUNG SOCRATES: Then how, Stranger, were the animals created
 991 Text |              begotten of one another?~STRANGER: It is evident, Socrates,
 992 Text |           must have occurred in both.~STRANGER: I see that you enter into
 993 Text |           YOUNG SOCRATES: Impossible.~STRANGER: Then shall I determine
 994 Text |               SOCRATES: By all means.~STRANGER: Suppose that the nurslings
 995 Text |             error of which you speak?~STRANGER: There were two; the first
 996 Text |           SOCRATES: What do you mean?~STRANGER: I mean to say that when
 997 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very good.~STRANGER: Before we can expect to
 998 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: And the myth was introduced
 999 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Very true.~STRANGER: And I cannot help thinking,
1000 Text |            YOUNG SOCRATES: Certainly.~STRANGER: Still they must be investigated